Ideological Bigotry Part XIII–Physically Assaulting the Handicapped
Even liberals have a low point that they would not cross. I just do not know where that low point occurs.
Once again, Bush Derangement Syndrome has led one liberal in particular to go overboard even by incredibly low liberal standards.
A basic premise ignored by many on the left is that just because one has the legal right to do something, it might be immoral. Just because one can do something does not mean they should. This starts with protesting.
When President Bush is giving a speech, protesters have the right to hold up signs and protest his leadership. That is democracy, and it is vital. Yet while these protesters are allowed to yell, scream, and shout vulgarities, I would argue that decency should request that they tone down the foul language.
Trying to win that argument is a nonstarter. I will instead go one step further and argue that the President’s family is not fair game unless they put themselves in the political arena. Hillary Clinton was fair game as First Lady because she injected herself into policy making decisions. Chelsea Clinton should have been off limits. Chelsea Clinton now is fair game because she is campaigning.
This is important because it was former President Bill Clinton that declared in his televised temper tantrum about Kenneth Starr that “all people, even Presidents, have private lives.”
John Kerry and John Edwards were hurt significantly when they brought up the sexual orientation of Mary Cheney. Vice President Cheney is fair game. His daughter, who was apolitical, and did not even play a role in her father’s campaign’s (her sister did), should have been left alone in peace.
Apparently the rules of civilized society simply do not apply to the great unwashed, aka liberals.
First Lady Laura Bush and her daughter Jenna have co-written a book. This book has nothing to do with the administration, or with anything remotely politically controversial. They wrote a children’s book called “Read all about it.”
Now unless one is violently opposed to helping children learn to read better, this should not be a political issue. Unlike a certain former First Lady, Laura Bush does not try to advance her agenda. She does what a First Lady should do…keep her mouth shut and talk about harmless warm and fuzzy issues. This is not sexism. Dennis Thatcher kept his mouth shut while Lady Margaret Thatcher did the heavy lifting.
Therefore, to show up and protest the Iraq War at a book discussion about child literacy involving people that had nothing to do with the decision to go to war is ludicrous, and not very decent. To curse and verbally abuse people is downright rude.
I am not sure liberals even acknowledge this part of the argument. After all, they see President Bush as poison, therefore everyone he touches is poison, therefore if his dog barks at them, they should bark back because the dog’s owner favored removing Saddam Hussein, who murdered many animals, as well as murdering many people that he tortured like animals beforehand.
Yet as I stated earlier, while reasonable conservative minds and liberal minds can disagree about the need to hurl epithets at private citizens, everybody should agree that violent protest is not an acceptable answer.
Liberals key cars. They remove lawn signs. Conservatives in general don’t do this because it would contradict the law and order platform we run on. Liberals are not bound by such constraints because liberals do not believe in constraints to begin with. There are not too many conservative republicans in blue shirts and red neckties out rioting in the street turning over cars and setting them on fire. Conservatives do not spray fur coats, raid animal testing factories and release the animals, or sit in trees and hurl epithets at innocent construction workers trying to do their jobs.
When did the peaceniks on the left become so violent? How can they be enraged at collateral damage in Iraq while harming fellow Americans?
While Laura and Jenna Bush were not harmed, an innocent victim in a wheelchair was not so lucky.
The 22 year old leftist (I am sure none of his college professors taught him anything that led to his lunacy) started screaming at the First Lady and her daughter. A republican couple that had come simply to hear a speech about reading to children told the man to stop yelling. He was shouting obscenities about the Iraq War, and they wanted quiet.
The man responded by repeatedly punching their daughter, an 18 year old girl confined to a wheelchair due to cerebral palsy. As she screamed (in this case she had a right to scream), he punched her shoulder blades and her thighs.
Yes, the leftist nut job was arrested on charges of assault and resisting arrest.
No, that does not settle the matter.
The mainstream media has ignored the story. I read the New York Post because they actually will report stuff like this.
There were no calls from Barack Obama to come together and respect each other. Hillary Clinton did not issue a statement condemning an attack on her “sister,” especially since the perpetrator was one of those “big boys” that Hillary keeps claiming are ganging up on her.
This story got virtually ignored.
I have often compared leftists to Palestinians, because they simply will not recognize that the other side has a fundamental right to exist.
The solution in my mind is to give these leftist wack jobs the equivalent of the “Simpsons” treatment.
In an episode of the Simpsons, Lisa rigged an electric shock device to her cupcakes. Every time Bart would try to steal it, he would get a shock. He then learne dnot to take the cupcakes.
The next time a leftist tries to assault a wheelchair confined woman just for being a republican, electrodes should be hooked up to his extremities. He should be forced to recite the phrase “republicans are human beings.” He should also be required to say “republicans have a right to exist.”
Most likely, the person will allow for republicans, but not conservatives. After a shock, the person will allow for conservatives, but not Bush supporters. After another shock, the person will allow for Bush supporters, as long as they don’t like him now and are against the war.
Finally, at some point, this person will have a mirror thrust in their face. They will look at their electroshocked body and Don King like hair and realize that all they had to do was admit that republicans are human beings and they would be free to go.
I suspect that a healthy plurality of the left, especially the young ones, would opt for death. This is no different than the members of the Klan who would rather die than stand next to a black man, as Senator Robert Byrd used to say, albeit using stronger language.
This crazy man be the extreme, but the problem on the left is that the line keeps moving. Humanity gets blurrier and blurrier as every behavior becomes relative. To quote the late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan, the left has “defined deviancy down.”
Conservatives condemn their lunatics. Liberals embrace theirs, and stay silent when a public embrace might be politically untenable.
Wendy and John Levitro are human beings. Their handicapped daughter Maureen did nothing to deserve the beating she endured.
If this were white against black, Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would be leading riots.
Yet when a liberal tries to bludgeon a republican to death, even a handicapped one, the melodic sound of chirping crickets is not far behind.
I began blogging to combat ideological bigotry. I will not rest until every liberal makes a pact to take their most hateful and cancerous elements, and get them to stop. They don’t even have to mean it. At least pay some perfunctory lip service.
The poorest and weakest among us are a cause celebre for the left…unless they are republican.
Such is life in a land where those who say violence is not the answer make an exception when it comes to a good old fashioned leftist style Bush bashing session, with the emphasis on bashing.
eric
April 25th, 2008 at 10:34 am
Do you have a link or cclip of the attacks? I never heard of it…
April 25th, 2008 at 10:55 am
“Liberals key cars. They remove lawn signs. Conservatives in general don’t do this because it would contradict the law and order platform we run on.”
You don’t know your history if you think that’s true. Would you like a few hunderd links to incidents involving disorderly conservatives?
I found this story, by the way (Fox and the NYP were pimping it)…
http://www.opednews.com/articles/genera_diannel_080424_new_york_post_lies_a.htm
Looks like there’s two sides to everything. The linked story above sounds a heck of a lot more believable.
JMJ
April 25th, 2008 at 11:18 am
Jersey.
Can the history lesson for once, Alright ?
Blacktygrrr said;
“When did the peaceniks on the left become so violent? ”
Point being, when did you guys go from sitting in hallways to destroying property and assulting people physically and verbally ?
Trying to cast equal blame in this matter is a losing battle for you simply due to the fact that whenever there is a disruption somehwere its always lefty looney fanatics.
Blowing things up, chasing free speech off stages, burning things , eco terrorists , code pink maximus lunatics screaming at congressional hearings, blocking traffic, defacing religious symbols and desacrating religious services for those who want to worship in peace.
The list goes on and on….
and on.
——————————————————————————————————————-
Ok. I read both versions jersey.
Unforunatly the post you refer is half cocked and full of omissions. No names of witnesses and the guy talking says he didnt see quite a few things.
Its crappy journalism at best.
here is the NY post version which definatly paints a more accurate and believable picture.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/04242008/news/regionalnews/bush_basher_smashes_disabled_teen__cops_107864.htm
I have actually seen a woman in a wheelchair get smacked by a man and I broke his leg.
No matter what, this peice of sh** has no reason or excuse to do what he did.
If you are going to try and minimize or rationalize this punks behavior you’re gonna have a heap of doo doo to deal with
April 25th, 2008 at 11:25 am
There’s no way I believe that story from the Post. It makes no sense. It figures that goofy trash-rag, the Post, and Fox, another “News”Corp living joke, would print such a ridiculous story. Anyone who believes this - boy, o, boy do I ever have a bridge that’s perfect for you! LOL!
JMJ
April 25th, 2008 at 11:37 am
Yea well, obviously you were the first one to buy that bridge.
You couldnt put it up for sale unless you owned it from the beggining
That is most likely why the obvious makes no sense to you
Why would a man with his daughter in a wheelchair start a physical alteration unless the girl had been harmed or was in danger ?
Read both and gather the facts and then cleanse with a process of logical elimination.
Did the cops arrest him for assult for no reason ?
I’m sure they talked to a number of witnesses right after that
April 25th, 2008 at 12:46 pm
Yeah, right. Some peacenik was beating on a cerebral palsey victim, and only the Post and Fox are reporting it, and the NYC cops were perfectly behaved as always.
What planet do you guys live on?
JMJ
April 25th, 2008 at 1:46 pm
This is a joke, right? Since when do peace activists, even VIOLENT ANGRY ones, beat up girls in wheelchairs? The story just doesn’t make any sense on the face of it. I’m thinking that German Talis is about to run into a lot of money - mostly from the Lovetros.
April 25th, 2008 at 4:37 pm
Who said he was a peace activist ?
Hes just a left nut
April 25th, 2008 at 4:57 pm
Jersey, heres the whole thing on video.
It starts off with this guy hassling the secret service.
Hes abviously not all there and sounds like hes wasted to top it off.
http://michellemalkin.com/2008/04/24/bds-outbreak-anti-war-nut-attacks-wheelchair-bound-girl/
April 25th, 2008 at 5:59 pm
“Who said he was a peace activist ?”
He’s part of the We Are Change organization. They are non-violent peace activists. They do not beat up random children in wheelchairs just because someone asks them to be quiet. They do, however, get attacked, threatened, harassed and unlawfully arrested. This entire story is a crock and this will become apparent as the lawsuit against the Lovetros and the police gets underway.
April 25th, 2008 at 6:28 pm
Okay Micky, I just watched the video ad nauseum. There’s no taped evidence here of an assault on a young lady in a wheelchair. And yes, he sounds like a loony. But then, as the Big Giant Head (great moniker, by the way) says, it does take guts to horse around with the Secret Service. And yes guys, the story sounds like a crock. Look, I’ve heard of stranger things, I just don’t think this went down the way the RWM is portraying it. The guy was annoying protester. Either the story was completely made up to cover for some service guy that lost his head, or some shmuck actually did attack this dude in an ideological furor (or both). Either of these scenarios are far more likely than the Post’s Story.
I’d rather let it go. I hope this kid doesn’t get into too much trouble. He reminds me of that character from The Jerk, Iron B@!!s McKenzie. I know I wouldn’t get in the face of a ss guy unless my life depended on it. Good for protesters. They test the system. Keeps ‘em on ‘der toes. I should have protested authority when I was a kid instead of just flaunting myself in front of it for laughs. It was a laugh, or 2000, yeah, but probably not nearly as rewarding. On the other hand, I’d rather not screw around with the service. Those guys are for real.
JMJ
April 25th, 2008 at 9:11 pm
I never said there was any evidence of anything other than the fact that he was obviously off to a good start.
It takes an idiot to screw with the secret service. The run a pretty thin line when it comes to BS.
It represents some really bad decision making.
I’m sure you’ve heard of stranger things, you’re a lefty.
It figures. Go to the defense of the bad guy with all the points against him. Typical lib ,defend the perp. Hell get his lawyer, he’ll get his rights that he babbles about not having while he screws up every one elses rights to just assemble and hear some people talk who had nothing to do with his beef.
How would you like it if you were playing for an audience and some one unplugged all the amps because they didnt like your music ? Or brought in a boombox and cranked it up ?
The bottom line is that he was arrested for criminal tresspass and assult, but not the other guy.
THOSE ARE THE FACTS
April 25th, 2008 at 9:19 pm
Lots of people get arrested for lots of things they never did. Especially people who contradict the status quo and especially people who do so loudly. Likewise lots of people NEVER get arrested for things that they SHOULD get arrested for, like assaulting someone with your crippled daughter’s wheelchair then pounding him with your fists because you don’t like what he has to say about 9/11. And being well concealed within the status quo increases your odds of escape.
April 25th, 2008 at 9:19 pm
THOSE ARE THE FACTS
April 25th, 2008 at 9:25 pm
“It takes an idiot to screw with the secret service.”
Thank you. LOL!
Ya’ know, I actually didn’t want to say it, but yes, it does indeed and in deed take an idiot. It’s one thing to protest, and I appreciate if not agree completely with his cause, but it’s another thing to just look for trouble - to pull a Marx Brothers routine in Manhatten with the First Lady - that’s just stupid. Funny, maybe, but really just stupid. But then stupid is funny afterall. And in a few ways he is right.
JMJ
April 25th, 2008 at 10:33 pm
Mr. Head.
I’ve been arrested unjustly myself. But THE FACT is that most people are not.
Usually charges are lowerd in plea bargains. But most of the time the guy arrested is wrong.
I dont know where you get “assault by wheelchair ” from.
The status quo at the time was a peaceful book reading being done by people who never did a thing to this loser. To top it off it was a childs book so I’m going to assume there were kids there.
The guy is an idiot as he has clearly shown. His decision making was in question by secret serviced long before he opened his yap. If hes stupid enough to antagonize the SS then I would put my money on him being the a**hole here.
Also, FACTS?
You contribute no facts to this conversation other than you perception and conveluted suspicions.
April 25th, 2008 at 10:58 pm
“I dont know where you get “assault by wheelchair ” from.”
Eyewitness testimony says that Mr. Lovetro started the whole thing by going out of his way to ram German with his daughter’s wheelchair (with his daughter IN it) then proceeded to punch him. Lawsuit in the works against the New York Post and I think also against Mr. Lovetro and possibly the police.
“The guy is an idiot as he has clearly shown”
Maybe. Fortunately (or unfortunately - depending on which angle you’re looking at this) it is not against the law to be an idiot. Being an idiot in and of itself is not an arrestable offense, nor should it be.
April 25th, 2008 at 11:21 pm
Head;
“Maybe. Fortunately (or unfortunately - depending on which angle you’re looking at this) it is not against the law to be an idiot. Being an idiot in and of itself is not an arrestable offense, nor should it be.”
Being an idiot is most always unfortunate from any perspective, and leads to poor decision making. In this guys case , so far its proven true.
And please, he did not get aressted for being an idiot. He was aressted because of his idiocy.
Eyewitness testimony is the most easily miscontrued and least valuble evidence there is.
I heard the moonbat on the video , she said ” I think” and “it looked like” and “Im not sure”.
Counter charges are always in the works as much as appeals are, so what ?
He was arrested and charged.
Common sense dictates that he was performoing all acts of aggression from the deal with the SS up to when he started yapping at the Bush’s.
I’ve been popped more than the average guy, and also done a fair amount of time.
Every shmuck you talk to in jail is innocent.
I,ve heard it all
The odds are not in his favor by any means.
I have not convicted this guy yet, I have only indicated my suspicions.
Yet Mr. Head is all ready to set him free and totally conviced of his innocense.
Amazing
April 25th, 2008 at 11:30 pm
“Being an idiot is most always unfortunate from any perspective, and leads to poor decision making.”
I didn’t say that being an idiot was not unfortunate, I said that it was fortunate (or unfortunate depending on ones perspective) that BEING an idiot is not ILLEGAL.
“And please, he did not get aressted for being an idiot. He was aressted because of his idiocy.”
Huh? Niether being an idiot nor being in posession of idiocy are unlawful or arrestable offenses. Shouldn’t one have to be in violation of a law in order to be justly arrested? What law did he break? Or do you just want to put people in jail that question the government?
April 25th, 2008 at 11:38 pm
” have not convicted this guy yet, I have only indicated my suspicions.”
A protester from a peaceful protest organization gets asked by some dude to be quiet and his reaction to this is to start beating up a crippled girl in a wheelchair? Shouldn’t that account warrant the most suspicion?
April 26th, 2008 at 12:13 am
Big head
You obviously havnt seen the video of his assine decision to harass a SS agent.
He actually is NOT peaceful.
Also, he is disturbing the majorities right to a peaceful assembly.
He took someones peace and disrupted it for his own egotistic gain.
His arrogance and idiocy leads him to believe that his rights are more important than those of the peaceful assembly that gatherd there for that purpose
The people that went there to listen to Mrs Bush and daughter deserve no suspicion.
What dont you understand about looking suspicious when you piss on someone elses party ? And harass and argue with the SS and try to get access to a restricted area ?
You seem to only want to argue your biased feelings and not anything of any real consequence or substance.
I will be glad to debate you if you can come up with some forms of documentation that show you actually have a clue as to what you are talking about.
But untill then …
April 26th, 2008 at 12:22 am
“You obviously havnt seen the video of his assine decision to harass a SS agent.”
LOL. What? The video plainly shows the SS agent harassing Gary. Are we watching two different videos?
http://rightvoices.com/2008/04/24/%e2%80%9cwe-are-change%e2%80%9d-picks-fight-with-secret-service-punches-girl-in-wheelchair-and-tries-to-explain-cotus-to-an-nypd-officer/
April 26th, 2008 at 12:27 am
“He took someones peace and disrupted it for his own egotistic gain.”
You’re disrupting my peace right now. Can I have you arrested? Probably not. I think you’re missunderstanding the law here. Show me the text of and actual LAW that Gary is breaking.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:28 am
My apologies, I did not see the previous note you left.
I feel I’m obligated to answer you for some reason.
BG;
“Huh? Niether being an idiot nor being in posession of idiocy are unlawful or arrestable offenses. ”
Idiots usually get arrested for being idiotic. That was the point.
I dont feel like playing semantics
BG;
“Shouldn’t one have to be in violation of a law in order to be justly arrested? ”
NO. You are arrested for suspicion. The courts decide if you were in violation.
Arrested means just that.
BG;
“Or do you just want to put people in jail that question the government?”
How convenient that you disregard the real crux of the issue. It was not his right to question the government that is the issue here. It is the right of the innocent to assemble without molestation.
There a millions of ways to get heard in this country. I have a feeling this poor slob just wanted to get some attention. He obviously failed miserably to get his message out.
And the message was an incredibly old one not worth repeating since every radical moonbat has been saying it for years now And it has been disproven time and time again.
What planet are you from ?
April 26th, 2008 at 12:34 am
“And it has been disproven time and time again.”
Hold on there a minute, what exactly is it that you are saying has been disproven time and time again?
“NO. You are arrested for suspicion.”
Then why wasn’t Lovetro arrested when he was obviously involved in this altercation and was throwing punches?
April 26th, 2008 at 12:44 am
Watch the video. The cop tells him what he is being charged with. And then the courts will decide.
You accepted this debate and challenged me by quoting my statement, so get real, please. If you want peace go away.
This arguement is foolish already.
You obviously think that we can just run into any function in the world and start screaming our opinions because of free speech.
This function was paid for and the space reserved for it. It was theirs for their purpose. Not his.
How about I just storm into any sppech being givin by anyone and start yapping /
What dont you understand about common decency and realizing thet your rights stop where another mans rights begin ?
He was operating by force, not freedom.
Good night young man
April 26th, 2008 at 12:52 am
BG.
Are you high ?
“Hold on there a minute, what exactly is it that you are saying has been disproven time and time again? ”
His message that he was screaming ! Can you even read ?
Watch the video or read the article and pay attention here.
The man was harrasing an SS agent and trying to access a restricted area.
Any sane person would find that outrageously suspicious.
And quite frankly if I were ther agent I would of arrested him on the spot for harassing and hindering the security detail
Common sense dictates the girl in the wheelchair was probably asked if she had been hit. I’m willing to bet she said yes. I’m also willing to give her character the benefit of the doubt instead of the idiot
April 26th, 2008 at 8:40 am
“Common sense dictates the girl in the wheelchair was probably asked if she had been hit. I’m willing to bet she said yes. I’m also willing to give her character the benefit of the doubt instead of the idiot.”
If you believe that, then you are one gullible authoritarian sycophant.
JMJ
April 26th, 2008 at 8:49 am
Jersey if you think for one minute that the cops did not ask her that question you have been gone too long.
Please, be serious. Really man, I always thought you’d been there and done that, guess not.
Gosh the girl is screaming and crying, the newspapers are reporting it.
Christ o mighty help me if that would not follow the flow of any normal investigation.
You know, like when the cops show up at a domestic quarrel or the scene of an altercation ?
Thats the usually the FIRST thing they ask. Ans seeing as how he has been charged with assult on the girl any of the dumbest cops in the world would even ask her.
Man, I’m glad I’m on this island because there is definatly in the air over there.
April 26th, 2008 at 9:19 am
This is like teaching pigs to sing.
This is the most idiotic debate I have ever been in.
I think Head and Jersey ( got dandruff?) are just being “A” holes on purpose.
When a SS service agent tells you to beat it, you beat it. And you dont try to argue past him.
The agent said nothing to this moron untill he tried to go where he was not supposed to. Showed him his I.D and told him that he could not go to the restricted area.
The agent was actually trying to do his job and ignore this piece of **** while he kept blabbing about his rights.
The agent was actually being nice by not having the idiot hauled away.
Think I’ll go Carnegie hall and stand up in the middle of a concert and start screaming about what a wretched woman Hillary is and see how long I last with the free speech BS reasoning.
April 26th, 2008 at 11:20 am
I’m thankful there are people out there who test the limits of our liberty. The dude may be a little nuts, but at least he has the you-know-whats to stand up for what he believes. I find it extermely difficult to think that a man like that would assault a girl in wheelchair with cerebral palsey. That’s just insane. It makes no sense whatsoever. On the other hand, hot-headed ideological conservative zealots being prone to violence makes perfect sense to me.
JMJ
April 26th, 2008 at 11:23 am
testing
April 26th, 2008 at 11:28 am
“Hold on there a minute, what exactly is it that you are saying has been disproven time and time again? ”
“His message that he was screaming ! Can you even read ?”
Ok. Let’s look at what he said. “How do you feel about people believing that your father was responsible for 9/11?” That’s not even a claim, it’s a question. How do you disprove a question? Even if he had said “People believe your father is repsonsible for 9/11″ that’s patently true since Gary himself obviously believes that her father was responsible for 9/11 and he is a “person”.
April 26th, 2008 at 11:40 am
(what’s wrong with this forum, it drops most of my post attempts then tells me I’ve already posted something that I have not)
April 26th, 2008 at 11:41 am
(continued….)
Then he said that our soldiers were sent to Iraq based on false intelligence. I haven’t seen this disproved even ONCE much less time and time again. In fact even the US government was admitted that our intelligence was bad. And it has since come out that the whitehouse had been planning to invade Iraq/Afghanistan/etc prior to 9/11 and was attempting to fix the intelligence around this agenda.
April 26th, 2008 at 11:46 am
continued……….
And to this day no nuclear weapons or WMD stockpiles have been found in Iraq and the US senate reported in 2006 that there had not been any functional link between Saddam and al-qaeda - the two primary reasons we were given over and over again ad naseum for invading Iraq.
And then Bush sadisticly jokes about the whole thing at an annual Radio and Television Corrspondence Dinner.
So Gary’s statement about bad intelligence leading us into Iraq is so widely accepted that even president Bush openly and publicly makes fun of himself for it, but yet somehow you insist that this has been disproven time and time again.
April 26th, 2008 at 11:52 am
Standing up for your rights is one thing.
The issue should not be his right to screw things up for everyone else.
I stand up for what I believe. but not at the discomfort of innocent people. And I dont make an a**hole out of myself in the process.
He quickly found out what his rights were, trust me.
What he did has nothing to do with large testicles.
It has to do with a typical self centerd liberal ” I am the center of it all” arroganced and selfishness.
Even if he did not hit the girl in the chair, it was a childs book reading and signing.
And this peice of work started his pathetic yapping and crap with kids around and a girl in a wheel chair next to him who did not deserve one bit what he did.
So much for caring so much about the kids , huh libs ?
All the points are against this guy.
He has shown extremly poor decision making from the get go and then later also.
I would like you to answer my question Jersey.
How would you like it if you were playing for an audience. Had paid for and rented the auditorium and some one unplugged all the amps because they didnt like your music ? Or brought in a boombox and some megaphones and just ruined your whole concert ?
JMJ;
“I find it extermely difficult to think that a man like that would assault a girl in wheelchair with cerebral palsey. That’s just insane. It makes no sense whatsoever. ”
And by the way, the disabled are one of the most assulted groups in this country.
It makes perfect sense.
I saw it happen myself at a girls birthday party we had on the beach in Wakiki.
We had a area roped off and you had to pay 2$ to get in because it was a kegger.
Sharon was her name. Some punk walked up to her all pissed off because he couldnt get in cuz he was broke and asked her if she wanted to dance. Knowing she was paralized he blasted her upside the face when she nicely sad no.
I saw this from about a 100ft away an went into a full blown rage and charged at this guy. He did not see me coming and I hit him like a semi going 100 mph, and broke his leg.
If this idiot you are so much in love with did hit this girl I’m surprised her father didnt kill him.
It was military beach open to the public. The biggest pleasure was when the MPS got there and made him walk 5 blocks to their hut on the leg of his that I broke.
When he came out of that hut he looked like a raw steak.
Hes not that great.
Ant shmuck can do what he did.
If he was so concerned about getting his message out he would of put some better thought and planning into it.
Hes just a bitter, lonely, selfish little man with no other way to get attention .
Now.
If you and the head actually have some believable examples of this guy showing intelligent decision making you will maybe succeed in makinga decent point other than your bloated sentiments for idiots.
I at least brought something tangible to this discussion with a video to show exactly what a moron this guy is and was from the start.
Neither of you have brought anything but your own box of kleenex
April 26th, 2008 at 11:59 am
…..and I have plenty of links to educated you about everything I’ve stated above but this crappy forum is rejecting every post I make that has a website url in it, so I’ve had to remove all the links from my last post.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:28 pm
bghead, We went to war because Saddam violated at least 24 UN Resolutions and UN Sanctions which include, but are not limited to: torturing innocent civilians, DEVELOPING WMD, and harboring terrorist camps. I’m not sure what selective reading you use to cite, “the US senate reported in 2006 that there had not been any functional link between Saddam and al-qaeda” because I attended numerous briefings “behind the vault” at the Pentagon and FORSCOM that show a direct link between Saddam and Al Qaeda. I have also been to the chemical manufacturing facility in Taji where Chemical Ali and his scientists developed and produced WMD. The media is wrong. You can cite as many articles, video clips, or whatever you want - I’ve been there, seen it, heard it, and lived it - and I’m going back in two weeks to live it for another year because I know what I’ve seen, heard, felt, and lived, and if we don’t help Iraq maintain a balance of power in the Middle East, we’ll all be speaking Arabic in a few years…or be dead.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:37 pm
BG;
“How do you feel about people believing that your father was responsible for 9/11?
That’s not even a claim, it’s a question. ”
The people he is talking about that believe that BS make that claim.
And that claim is BS because the plans for 911 were made 5 years in advance of Bushs presidency.
He is no way responsable.
All previous administrations own that blame.
BG;
“And it has since come out that the whitehouse had been planning to invade Iraq/Afghanistan/etc prior to 9/11 and was attempting to fix the intelligence around this agenda.
Do you proof that anyone was fixing anything?
BG;
“So Gary’s statement about bad intelligence leading us into Iraq is so widely accepted that even president Bush openly and publicly makes fun of himself for it, but yet somehow you insist that this has been disproven time and time again.”
here BG.
I’m tired of your delusional dribble that I’ve heard from every monnbat for 5 years now.
here is all the “disprovement” and facts you need.
Because as much as I know you would love to change the subject here its not about Iraq. Its about some confused selfish little germ.
http://micky2.wordpress.com/2007/12/04/those-pesky-little-things-called-facts/
These are sources straight from congessional hearings and reputable media.. Not a bunch of leftisit websites or publications.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:42 pm
—-
“We went to war because Saddam violated at least 24 UN Resolutions and UN Sanctions which include, but are not limited to: torturing innocent civilians, DEVELOPING WMD,”
Which it was later discovered that he didn’t have……..and that it was known that he wouldn’t have because the intelligence was fixed around the policy of invasion.
“and harboring terrorist camps.”
Not just “terrorist campes” but AL QAEDA terroist camps which was also later found out to be hogwash because the intelligence was being fixed around a new policy.
“I’m not sure what selective reading you use to cite, “the US senate reported in 2006 that there had not been any functional link between Saddam and al-qaeda””
msnbc.msn.com/id/5223932/
washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A47812-2004Jun16.html
whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/05/20070522-1.html
April 26th, 2008 at 12:46 pm
“Do you proof that anyone was fixing anything?”
timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article387374.ece
cnn.com/2005/US/05/11/britain.war.memo/
downingstreetmemo.com/
April 26th, 2008 at 12:48 pm
“I’m tired of your delusional dribble that I’ve heard from every monnbat for 5 years now.”
Is this delusional too:
cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/03/26/bush.wmd.jokes/index.html
youtube.com/watch?v=YjXPOxnu2N8
Makes me sick to my stomach every time I watch that. It should make you feel the same way.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:54 pm
(this exchange would flow a lot more smoothly if I were allowed to post full URLs, What’’s up with this forum software?)
April 26th, 2008 at 12:54 pm
MSNBC ? ROTFLMAO !
Washington post ?
The Times, CNN
Jeez, buy us all a copy of Farenheight 911 also why dont you !
The point is he was developing them. get real bro.
And the intelligence was derived by 21 other countries including the US.
I’m not going to bother cutting and pasting your links because the war is not on topic here.
I dont play dodge ball.
April 26th, 2008 at 12:59 pm
“Jeez, buy us all a copy of Farenheight 911 also why dont you !”
You’re comparing the mainstream NBC network, which is owned by one of our largest military industrial contractors to Michael Moore?
How about Fox News? No good either?
foxnews.com/story/0,2933,336730,00.html
April 26th, 2008 at 12:59 pm
Bghead, I have read many articles and seen reports of events in which I participated - and the reports are generally wrong or skewed. You are going to split hairs about whether they were Al Qaeda terrorist camps or simply generic terrorist camps??? And what does “developing” mean? …in the process of making…and it’s ok that he murdered and tortured innocents… I know, we let it slide in so many other places, we should have let it slide there…
Concerning war plans – we have war plans for almost every nation on earth – it’s called preparation. It’s no secret we have a war plan for Iran, Syria, Pakistan, Russia, you name it – we have a plan. Just because we have a plan doesn’t mean we will necessarily implement it….and I can hear the howls now…”just because Saddam was developing WMD doesn’t mean he was going to use it”…
Again, I’ve seen it, heard it, and lived it, so you can cite any videos or articles you want – I know the truth, and our national security – that means my wife and kids, and my neighbors’ wives and kids – depend on a balance of power in the Middle East. In twenty years when we’re freezing our butts off because of a cooling trend, the truth about WMD, Al Qaeda, and global warming may finally emerge…
April 26th, 2008 at 1:03 pm
“The point is he was developing them”
No, the point was that this administration told us that he HAD them and that this was why we needed to invade. But the truth was that he DIDN’T have them therefore Gary’s statement about sending our soldiers into war based on false intelligence was correct.
“I’m not going to bother cutting and pasting your links”
Why doesn’t that surprise me?
“because the war is not on topic here.”
Why did you change the subjec to the war then?
April 26th, 2008 at 1:04 pm
No Mr. Big head.
You are comprable to Michael Moore.
Sorry, guess i have to spell everything out for you.
What the hell.
If it the war you want. Its the war you’ll get.
Bush lied in order to go to war. And George Washingtons teeth were made out of wood.
June 26, 1993 - Missile attack launched in retaliation against Iraqi plot to assassinate President Bush. ( Clinton rattling his pocket knife)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/717924.stm
Tuesday, 18 April, 2000, 13:19 GMT 14:19 UK
Iraqi rights abuses condemned
The Iraqi people suffer “all-pervasive oppression”
The United Nations has strongly condemned Iraq for its “systematic, widespread and extremely grave violations” of human rights.
The UN Commission on Human Rights adopted a European Union-sponsored resolution criticising Baghdad’s “all-pervasive repression and oppression sustained by broad-based discrimination and widespread terror”.
Thirty-two of the 53 Commission members voted in favour of the motion, with the remainder - including China and Russia - abstaining.
The resolution also condemned Iraq’s widespread and arbitrary use of the death penalty and its suppression of freedom of expression.
http://www.worldpress.org/specials/iraq/
“On Feb. 5, U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell came before the United Nations Security Council and laid out the Bush administration’s case against Iraq. As a hushed chamber listened intently, Secretary Powell detailed a web of evidence against Saddam Hussein’s regime.”
Powell’s argument could be divided into two main tracks. The first centered on the premise that Iraq had to face the penalties for having flouted numerous Security Council resolutions. “Last Nov. 8, this council passed Resolution 1441 by a unanimous vote,” the secretary said. “The purpose of that resolution was to disarm Iraq of its weapons of mass destruction. Iraq had already been found guilty of material breach of its obligations, stretching back over 16 previous resolutions and 12 years.”
“Iraq has now placed itself in danger of the serious consequences called for in U.N. Resolution 1441. And this body places itself in danger of irrelevance if it allows Iraq to continue to defy its will without responding effectively and immediately.”
While the Security Council has passed a series of resolutions concerning Iraq over the past 12 years, only one explicitly authorized the use of force. Resolution 678, passed on Nov. 29, 1990, authorized member states to “use all necessary means to uphold and implement Resolution 660 (1990) and all subsequent relevant resolutions and to restore international peace and security in the area.”
April 16 2003.
Saddam was found to be violating oil for food programs by selling the food received in exchange for oil for cash. His country was starving so he could build anther mansion/palace.
This was a violation of peace treaties enacted after the first gulf war, it is also an act of war and justification for disbanding the Iraqi leadership.
http://shotsacrossthebow.com/archives/001591.html
More Iraqi violations…
found here.
Before the war, Syria was said to be receiving as much as 200,000 b/d of oil through the pipeline, paying as much as $1 billion/year to Iraq, making it the single largest source of revenue for Baghdad outside the UN’s oil-for-aid program.
But the US action put an end to that arrangement, ending Washington’s formerly benign policy towards Syria’s illicit imports of Iraqi oil.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1927537/posts
Posted on 11/18/2007 9:15:32 AM PST by Son House
Iraqi Firings: Since 2000, Iraqi forces have fired on U.S. and British pilots 1,600 times. In 2002, Iraqi forces fired on U.S. and British pilots406 times. Since September 18, just hours after Saddam promised to “allow the return of the United Nations inspectors without conditions” and expressed his desire “to remove any doubts that Iraq still possesses weapons of mass destruction,”
1. Elected Democrats like Reid and Pelosi have no loyalty to the Current Military Personal who are in harms way, or they would make sure they have funding no matter what.
2. President Clinton had little loyalty to the Military, or Iraqi forces firing on U.S. Pilots would not have continued into the 2000.
3. Iran attacking our Military Personal is not acceptable.
Revisiting these historical facts should drive home the point that Saddam was in violation of the terms under which we spared him after liberating Kuwait — with or without WMDS and with our without ties to Al Qaeda.
Clinton would have been well justified to invade Iraq at just about any time during his second term — problem is Clinton lacked the courage to do what really needed to be done (and instead attacked Yugoslavia.)
No-Fly Zones, the Iraqi Violations.
Operation Northern Watch enforces the no-fly zone north of the 36th parallel in Iraq and monitors Iraqi compliance with UN Security Council resolutions 678, 687, and 688. The United States and the United Kingdom provide about 45 aircraft and more than 1,400 personnel to support the operation.
Operation Southern Watch enforces the no-fly zone south of the 33rd parallel in Iraq and monitors compliance with United Nations Security Council Resolutions 687, 688, and 949. The United States and the United Kingdom provide about 150 aircraft and 6,000 forces to support the operation.
All of the above were acts of war and aggression against the U.S.
Not even mentioning the thousands og human rights violations taking place on a daily basis.
All were violations of peace treaties enacted after the first gulf war/Kuwait invasion.
George W. Bush never claimed to have been to Iraq. Rather, both he and Tony Blair deferred to intelligence reports and, at the same time, complained that their sources were limited by the fact that Saddam would not allow inspections under the agreements that ended the Gulf War; nor would he respect numerous UN mandates to allow unrestricted monitoring.
Though rare, there are some in the world who allege that Bush knew the reports were wrong (in some mysterious fashion), but went to war under false pretenses anyway. This would certainly qualify as a lie, but it also defies common sense and probably speaks to the ignorance, delusion, or dishonesty of the person making such an assertion.
Saddam was also paying Palestinian suicide bombers families $25,000 ea. to go into Afghanistan and blow up Americans, this was most definitely an act of war. ———————————————–
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,48822,00.html
Saddam Pays 25K for Palestinian Bombers
Tuesday, March 26, 2002
By Ken Layne
Saddam Hussein is paying $25,000 to the relatives of Palestinian suicide bombers — a $15,000 raise much welcomed by the bombers’ families. In Tulkarm, one of the poorest towns on the West Bank, a member of the Palestinian Legislative Council handed out the checks from Saddam. The payments have been made for at least two years, but the amount has suddenly jumped up by $15,000 — a bonus for the families of martyrs, to reward those taking part in the escalating war against Israel. Paul McGeough, reporting from the West Bank, was the only foreign correspondent in the hall Monday night when a Palestinian official handed out the checks. McGeough’s story in today’s Sydney Morning Herald describes a very hellish twist on the Academy Awards: The men at the top table then opened Saddam’s checkbook and, as the names of 47 martyrs were called, family representatives went up to sign for checks written in U.S. dollars. (Story continues , click on the link )Below are some more obtrusive notes that never seem to hit the mainstream medis. Written in Dec 2006. Does anyone recall seeing this on your evening news ? But I’m sure you got a good shot of all the mourning mothers screaming over the body of their son that was killed by some insurgent, and I’ll bet you’ve seen your share of crying babies on Baghdad sidewalks.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:08 pm
“You are going to split hairs about whether they were Al Qaeda terrorist camps or simply generic terrorist camps??? ”
It’s not hair splitting. Mickey is claiming that Gary, the protester, expressed beliefs that have been proven wrong “time and time again”. One of Gary’s two statements was that our soldiers had been sent to Iraq based on false intelligence. One peice of this false intelligence that was used to garner support for war was that Saddam/Iraq and Al Qaeda has an operational relationship and the US senate investigation revealed plainly that there was no evidence of such a relationship. Therefore Gary’s statement was correct and Mickey is WRONG.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:14 pm
it is quite appropriate that the title of Eric’s blog is “Ideological Bigotry”. Almost every Congressperson, Senator, and/or politician in the United States is quoted somewhere as saying Saddam had WMD, and we must do something to stop him from using them. What do you call VBIEDs, IEDs, and Chemicals that kill or maim 50 -60 people, Weapons of Minor Distraction? I’m not going to change your mind because you enjoy being stuck on your ideological bigotry. I am stuck on mine, as well, but if there are those on the fence who can read this and make a fair assessment - based on what I’ve experienced and not read about, then it is worth responding to your media-driven hate America first talking points.
I think it was you who turned the subject to war when you mentioned something about “disproved”…
April 26th, 2008 at 1:18 pm
“And what does “developing” mean? …in the process of making…and it’s ok that he murdered and tortured innocents… I know, we let it slide in so many other places, we should have let it slide there”
No, the problem here is manifold:
1) Other countries now NEED wmds in order to protect themselves from the new imperial pre-emptive strike policies of the US and our desire to control world oil supplies. So, ethically, they should be allowed to have them as long as the US is acting like a bunch of a-holes.
2) The US tortures and murders people also. In fact innocent people are dieing in Iraq at many times the rate they were dying under Saddam. So if human suffering is really your concern then you need to be in support of immediate and complete withdrawal from Iraq, bringing Saddam back from the grave and reinstating him as dictator.
3) We financed the murder and torture of Iraqis while Saddam was in power so you’ll forgive me for not trusting the US to be the ones to go in and try to stop Iraqis for being murdered and tortured.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:25 pm
“I think it was you who turned the subject to war when you mentioned something about “disproved”…”
From Mickey, April 26, 12:28am
“There a millions of ways to get heard in this country. I have a feeling this poor slob just wanted to get some attention. He obviously failed miserably to get his message out. And the message was an incredibly old one not worth repeating since every radical moonbat has been saying it for years now And it has been disproven time and time again.”
Then I asked him what exactly had been disproved and he said “his message” about the war in Iraq. Just scroll on up and check it out. Now he’s running away from the subject.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:27 pm
BG;
No, the problem here is manifold:
“1) Other countries now NEED wmds in order to protect themselves from the new imperial pre-emptive strike policies of the US and our desire to control world oil supplies. So, ethically, they should be allowed to have them as long as the US is acting like a bunch of a-holes. ”
Iraq was not allowed by international law to posess these weapons.
Read my post per Gen. Powell
And just for your information BG it is the radical muslims that would love to not only control the world oil supply, they will destroy it if they have to just so America does not get any.
Bin Laden has already stated that he is trying to destabalize and crush america finacially
“2) The US tortures and murders people also. In fact innocent people are dieing in Iraq at many times the rate they were dying under Saddam. So if human suffering is really your concern then you need to be in support of immediate and complete withdrawal from Iraq, bringing Saddam back from the grave and reinstating him as dictator.”
Most of the innocent were killed by insurgents and the rest choose to fight.
Saddam would not function very well in his present state. So I believe now that you Mr. Big head are truly out of your mind
3) We financed the murder and torture of Iraqis while Saddam was in power so you’ll forgive me for not trusting the US to be the ones to go in and try to stop Iraqis for being murdered and tortured.
”
If you distrust America so much you should get the F*** out
April 26th, 2008 at 1:28 pm
Eagle, what did you think about Bush making fun of all the soldiers he sent to die in Iraq over false WMD intelligence? Here it is again:
cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/03/26/bush.wmd.jokes/index.html
AND
youtube.com/watch?v=YjXPOxnu2N8
April 26th, 2008 at 1:33 pm
Look buster BG !
I have been more than patient with your (redacted) ass.
But it was most certainly you who tried to transfer this conversation to the war ! NOT ME !
I have told you once or twice to get back on topic and you still dribble about the war.
I will not tolerate a liar.
This blog I feel is a few notchs above your type of decorum.
I suggest you go somewhere like the KOS where your kind of behavior is accepted.
To engage in the exchange of facts and ideas and beliefs is what we do in debates.
But dont make things up.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:35 pm
“If you distrust America so much you should get the F*** out”
That’s a strange philosophy. I was taught in our american public education system that if you didn’t like what the government was doing that you were supposed to do whatever you could to change it. And according to our consitution (the highest law in our land) you actually have the legal right (although not necessarily the means) to OVERTHOW the federal government. Are you from China or something? Things work a little differently over here - or at least they are supposed to.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:39 pm
I’m not going to plat childish semantic games BG.
MY mentioning the ididots statement about iraq was not intended to bring this into an Iraq war debate and tyou know it .
Do we have to go study Sigmund Freud now because I think hes insane ?
Will we tear apart the constitution so as to justify this idiot.
What other tributaries would you like to explore ?
April 26th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
If you dont trust it do you really think it will change ?
Would you make a deal with a snake ?
April 26th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
“But it was most certainly you who tried to transfer this conversation to the war ! NOT ME !”
I showed everyone the exact post above where you shifted the conversation to the war in Iraq, not sure what other proof you need.
“I suggest you go somewhere like the KOS where your kind of behavior is accepted.”
You mean the “behavior” of having an opinion that is different from yours?
“To engage in the exchange of facts and ideas and beliefs is what we do in debates”
From an earlier post from Mickey:
“I’m not going to bother cutting and pasting your links”
“If you don’t trust this country then get the f*** out!!”
Yeah, that’s some real high class exchanging of ideas and beliefs you have going on there.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
Wow! Admittedly, I had some misgivings when I implied that you are part of the Hate America first crowd. Thanks for relieving my angst. I guess oil prices keep going up because we control so much of it now… I’m not sure what your agenda is other than to subvert the integrity of the US government, and I am rather amused that you would even consider making some of your arguments with someone who has spent his past seven years directly or indirectly planning, organizing, and fighting Islamo-fascism…
April 26th, 2008 at 1:45 pm
“MY mentioning the ididots statement about iraq was not intended to bring this into an Iraq war debate and tyou know it .”
You made a false statement about what Gary yelled at the Bushes. I corrected you. That’s all. If you want to keep stubbornly disagreeing with me on it without providing any logic or anything to back up what you are saying about this then go ahead but that obliges me to come right back at you, post exactly what Gary said again for everyone here to see, and then carefully explain, AGAIN, why what he said has not been “disproven time and time again” but is in fact widely accepted knowledge throughout the US including the federal government itself.
April 26th, 2008 at 1:55 pm
“Thanks for relieving my angst. I guess oil prices keep going up because we control so much of it now”
Yes, actually, that’s exactly right. That was part of the agenda of invading the middle east - to control oil prices….but to make and keep them HIGH, not low. And to try to prevent oil rich nations from moving their oil trade off of the US dollar. There’s some excellent descriptions of this that should be required reading/viewing:
http://www.dollarsandsense.org/archives/2007/0507palast.html
Also see Lindsey Williams, a whislteblower who sat in on board meetings with top oil industry, imf and world bank execs who explains what’s being done with oil. $200 a barrel in a year or two and gas up to at least $7-$8 per gallon.
April 26th, 2008 at 2:00 pm
bghead, You are absolutely correct that you not only have a right, but also an obligation to overthrow a government that is corrupt. Unfortunately, our current administration is under attack by Islamo-fascists who are using the media to poison people’s heads with crap, thereby subverting our government. I made a vow to protect the citizens of the US against all enemies - foreign and domestic - and our biggest enemy in the US today is a combination of media and the population they corrupt with half-truths and skewed information. Part of my protecting the citizens is through Information Operations - the same campaign we are now using in Iraq - I sleep well at night because “the truth will set you free”, and I am living in truth.
April 26th, 2008 at 2:00 pm
“I am rather amused that you would even consider making some of your arguments with someone who has spent his past seven years directly or indirectly planning, organizing, and fighting Islamo-fascism”
You were compartmentalized. You know whatever your superiors WANT or NEED you to know and they know whatever THEIR superiors want and need THEM to know, and so on. The federal government, particularly the military and intelligence agencies, are not horizontal organizations. There are also people with government/military credentials that would make you look like a piker that flatly disagree with many of the things you’ve said in here.
You can find SOME of them here: patriotsquestion911.com
April 26th, 2008 at 2:08 pm
I obviously don’t agree with your argument, but I’ll check out the link and make another assessment. Taking a simplistic approach, if oil prices keep going up it may serve as a forcing function to develop electrically powered vehicles and wean ourselves from it. One of my ancestors (great, greta, great? grandfather) and his brother bought some property near the water in New York in the mid 1700s and were mining salt… they ended up losing everything because oil kept fouling up their salt… “that nasty black ooze was everywhere”… perspective…
April 26th, 2008 at 2:14 pm
“Unfortunately, our current administration is under attack by Islamo-fascists”
To the extent that this is true, it’s appears to be the result of this administration’s actions and policies, so I’m all for this administration being attacked by whomever it is causing undue harm. Let’s stop CREATING people that allegedly want to kill us first then see who is still left standing that wants to kill us and then come talk to me about SUPPORTING this administration.
“who are using the media to poison people’s heads with crap”
Islamofacists control NBC, CBS, CNN, FOX, Cspan, Wall Street Journal, etc? Got any links to back that up with? Was this part of your clearance debriefing or something?
“thereby subverting our government.”
So…..islamofacists (which we funded….and STILL fund by the way) are conrolling our government……and your job………your job is to get it back from them?
“I made a vow to protect the citizens of the US against all enemies - foreign and domestic”- and our biggest enemy in the US today is a combination of media and the population they corrupt with half-truths and skewed information. Part of my protecting the citizens is through Information Operations”
That sounds interesting. Does that have anything to do with the Pentagon’s Office of Strategic Influence (OSI) which stated publicly that it would henceforth be intentionaly disseminating false news stories to media outlets throughout the world?
April 26th, 2008 at 2:14 pm
“the same campaign we are now using in Iraq - I sleep well at night because “the truth will set you free”, and I am living in truth.”
hmmm……
April 26th, 2008 at 2:18 pm
Bg.
You have obviously shown that yoiu are not interested in the truth.
You only want to appear correct.
#1
The idiot who disrupted the assembly was in the wrong.
It was not his assembly. Period.
Did he hit the girl?
We will find out.
He plainly was antagonizing SS and repeatedly asked for access to a secure area.
BG:
“How do you feel about people believing that your father was responsible for 9/11?” That’s not even a claim, it’s a question. How do you disprove a question?”
Believing Bush caused 911 is not a question, its an accusation.
When a court believes you’ve done something you stand accused.
And a quick study of Al Queda transcripts and Bin Ladens letter to America disproves this. It took 5 ears to plan. Five years in advance of the attack and Bushs election.
So the question is mute.
BG:
“Then he said that our soldiers were sent to Iraq based on false intelligence. I haven’t seen this disproved even ONCE much less time and time again.”
No one disputes the faulty intelligence.
But the fact is that there was still much more evidence that was concrete in justifying the invasion.
Please read the facts above.
I will bet eagle has a little better access to inteligence than you do BG. Puhleeze.
April 26th, 2008 at 2:20 pm
BG;
“That sounds interesting. Does that have anything to do with the Pentagon’s Office of Strategic Influence (OSI) which stated publicly that it would henceforth be intentionaly disseminating false news stories to media outlets throughout the world?’
Sounds good to me.
Its called propoganda dude. Ya know, did the word “strategic” give you a hint ?
April 26th, 2008 at 2:27 pm
Unlike the movies, books, and newspaper depictions, I am not a myopic minion mushroom who thrives on the crap people feed me in the dark - “compartmentalized”. I am a US citizen first and a Soldier second…and other priorities before those two…there is no doubt in my mind that many people could make me look stupid, ignorant, or ill-informed. Regardless, I know what I’ve seen, and I would much rather spend another year away from my family today than risk losing my freedom at a later date.
I read the link. Interesting info but really irrelevant to the issue. I haven’t bought into the Conspiracy Theory yet…
April 26th, 2008 at 2:31 pm
“He plainly was antagonizing SS and repeatedly asked for access to a secure area.”
Just standing on a public sidewalk is now considered “antagonism”? Asking an officer if you can go somewhere is antagonism? You wouldn’t happen to be biased at all would you?
“Sounds good to me. Its called propoganda dude.”
I sure it DOES sound good to you since you are apparently having a lifelong morality deficit. But Eagle is claiming that the military is trying to win our country back from islamofacists by disseminating the “truth” and that he his assisting in this process and is himself “LIVING in the truth”. That doesn’t seem to jive to well with well known US military endeavors and departments like the OSI. Care to reconcile this for me since Eagle seems to have gone off somewhere to “free” us?
April 26th, 2008 at 2:41 pm
“No one disputes the faulty intelligence.”
Uhm……..YOU did. That’s what started this whole thing, remember?
“But the fact is that there was still much more evidence that was concrete in justifying the invasion.”
Where?
“And a quick study of Al Queda transcripts and Bin Ladens letter to America disproves this.”
Where?
“I will bet eagle has a little better access to inteligence than you do BG. Puhleeze.”
Does he have more access to intelligence then these guys:
patriotsquestion911.com
General Wesley Clark
Major General Albert Stubblebine
Col. Ronald D. Ray
Lt. Col. Robert Bowman, PhD, U.S. Air Force
Lt. Col. Karen U. Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force
Lt. Col. Anthony Shaffer
Capt. Scott J. Phillpott
Major Erik Kleinsmith, U.S. Army – Former Chief of Intelligence
Col. David Hunt, MA, U.S. Army (ret) – Expert in Special Operations, Counter Terrorism and Intelligence Operations
Major John M. Newman, PhD, U.S. Army (ret) – Former Executive Assistant to the Director of the National Security Agency
Major Scott Ritter, Former Marine Corps Intelligence Officer and Chief Weapons Inspector for the United Nations Special Commission in Iraq 1991 - 1998.
?????
April 26th, 2008 at 2:44 pm
“Interesting info but really irrelevant to the issue”
Top senior military, intelligence, and law enforcement questioning the government’s official story on 9/11 is irrelevant to the government’s official story on 9/11?
April 26th, 2008 at 2:50 pm
bghead - if the above is what you got out of our discussions, I apologize for not being able to describe my beliefs and intentions more adequately.
Eric - sorry I fuzzed up the major focus of your blog, but at least two of us were able to demonstrate ideological bigotry to support your message
April 26th, 2008 at 2:55 pm
BG:
“Just standing on a public sidewalk is now considered “antagonism”? Asking an officer if you can go somewhere is antagonism? You wouldn’t happen to be biased at all would you?”
Look bro. You have to start being a little more honest here.
You and I have both watched the video.
He repeatedly tried to weasel his way past the agent, he gave him a hard time when the agent asked him for ID instead of showing it , he was bugging the crap out of the agent who repeatedly asked him to leave and told him why he wasnt allowed access.
He was not “JUST” standing on the sidewalk .
He just of said I’m sorry and walked away. The agent let him know that he was being a pest by offering enforcement if he didnt comply. The agent was kind enough not to follow through on the threats. Athough the agent had every right to have this guy hauled off after asking the first time to leave him alone.
He is protecting the first lady. his job was not to explain the constitution to this idiot.
Although he was kind enough to give him the web addresses to go look up the laws he was enforcing.
BG:
“I sure it DOES sound good to you since you are apparently having a lifelong morality deficit. But Eagle is claiming that the military is trying to win our country back from islamofacists by disseminating the “truth” and that he his assisting in this process and is himself “LIVING in the truth”. That doesn’t seem to jive to well with well known US military endeavors and departments like the OSI. Care to reconcile this for me since Eagle seems to have gone off somewhere to “free” us?”
Yea, Eagle probably does have better things to do than try to make his country look like a complete farce.
Morality defacit ?
Yea, you’re right. I’ve spent entirely too much time on you.
God forbid we tell the enemy exactly what we are doing.
I guess we could leave that up the lib mainstream media
April 26th, 2008 at 2:56 pm
What I found most interesting about this thread was how that “idiological bigots” beliefs corresponded with the beliefs (and high level security clearance KNOWLEDGE) of senior military, intelligence, and law enforcement officials.
patriotsquestion911.com
But I’m just quirky like that..
April 26th, 2008 at 3:02 pm
“The agent was kind enough not to follow through on the threats.”
No, he was restraining himself to operate within the confines of THE LAW,
“You have to start being a little more honest here.”
I have to be more honest but it’s ok for our military intelligence to systematically disseminate lies to our media? Seems a little imbalanced. And where am I being dishonest?
“I guess we could leave that up the lib mainstream media”
Fox News? - one of my sources above
April 26th, 2008 at 3:07 pm
Ok, I guess were done here. Thankyou. This was VERY enlightening.
April 26th, 2008 at 3:17 pm
bghead - I read the oil piece - I thought that’s what you wanted me to look at. I am not MI and did not intend to misrepresent my credentials. However, yes, I have more access to intel than some of the people you mention - but rather than parse words, the reason is because I’m still in, and they aren’t, so they don’t have the same access anymore! Having said that, my views are my own, not representative of the military…but that’s why I don’t share name or other information. My specialty is strategic plans and operations, so although I am not an expert in military intelligence, I must know whatever my boss, and his boss want me to know in order to plan accordingly. I recently left that arena to take over a Military Transition Team - to assist the iraqis to assist themselves. That’s our stated goal now.
I know a couple people on that list, and I have no regard for them. Likewise, they have no regard for me. My personal opinion is that they use the term “patriots” loosely. No, you don’t have to be in the military or agree with our government’s policies to be a patriot, but I do not share their views.
April 26th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
p.s. My comment, “I must know whatever my boss, and his boss want me to know..” was intended to be tongue in cheek…
April 26th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
“I recently left that arena to take over a Military Transition Team - to assist the iraqis to assist themselves. That’s our stated goal now.”
LOL
OK
Mass murdering people in order to “assist” them. That’s an interesting policy. How is that “assistance” going by the way? Five years and three trillion dollars later.
April 26th, 2008 at 3:23 pm
Yea, it just proves that you did not read much of what I sad and that you have an incredibly selective attention span.
I never disputed the intelligence, now you are making things up.
I clearly said thay even without the WMDs we still had concrete reasons to invade Iraq.
Here ya go bub.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/nov/24/theobserver
OBL:
” Allah, the Almighty, legislated the permission and the option to take revenge. Thus, if we are attacked, then we have the right to attack back. Whoever has destroyed our villages and towns, then we have the right to destroy their villages and towns. Whoever has stolen our wealth, then we have the right to destroy their economy. And whoever has killed our civilians, then we have the right to kill theirs. ”
If you read the whole letter it becomes even more evident he wants to destroy our economy.
You’ll probably say hes trying to make peace with us
April 26th, 2008 at 3:24 pm
“My specialty is strategic plans and operations, so although I am not an expert in military intelligence”
Yes, that much is clear. But some of the people on that site ARE experts in military intelligence. Sooooo……. where does that leave us????
April 26th, 2008 at 3:31 pm
There is no “US” because there are quite a few things I’m sure Eagle is just not allowed to let you in on
April 26th, 2008 at 3:31 pm
“I never disputed the intelligence, now you are making things up.”
“And the message was an incredibly old one not worth repeating since every radical moonbat has been saying it for years now And it has been disproven time and time again.” - Mickey
Looks like a dispute to me, Mickey.
“Thus, if we are attacked, then we have the right to attack back. Whoever has destroyed our villages and towns, then we have the right to destroy their villages and towns. Whoever has stolen our wealth, then we have the right to destroy their economy. And whoever has killed our civilians, then we have the right to kill theirs.”
You don’t agree with that? Sounds like someone just trying to defend themselves to me. People don’t have a right to defend themselves?
And how do we know where this letter came from since the Pentagon has announced that they will henceforth be distributing false news to us?
April 26th, 2008 at 3:42 pm
The people on that site discuss 9/11. I was discussing the misinformation the media has used leading up to the war and following the war - the same type of misinformation as”Mass murdering people in order to “assist” them.” How could you even think that? I understand passion, but let’s use a spot of logic. Again, you can try to discredit me by making fun of what you perceive as my lack of experience in military intel, but that is again a case of false logic - and I mentioned in this post once before, many of the Arabs use the same logic you use - how they feel about something, regardless of the facts or five senses - is what becomes truth. So I can make a huge leap (ok, so now I’m jumping to conclusions) that it wouldn’t bother you to have our government taken over because their views are similar to yours.
April 26th, 2008 at 3:44 pm
Chow
April 26th, 2008 at 3:59 pm
Stop playing games BG
I already explained this one.
BG;
Looks like a dispute to me, Mickey. ”
There is no dispute that the 911 terrorist arrived here Years before Bush was elected.
BG:
“You don’t agree with that? Sounds like someone just trying to defend themselves to me. People don’t have a right to defend themselves?”
It has absolutley nothing to do with agreement.
It just proved my point that he said he wants to destroy our economy
You asked where, I showed you.
You bitch about the US killing innocents in Iraq and yet you condone OBL.
I had you figured out in the beggining when you claimed I was disrubing your peace.
You came to a blog to debate, didnt like what you heard and then pitched a bitch and said I was disturbing your peace.
Just like the moron that disturbed the peace of everyone at the book reading you think life is all about you.
You come here and go Waaa ! you’re disturbing my peace.
If you found it so disturbing then you should of just left.
Hust like the way you feel about your country.
Hopefully you can find a country to live in where everyone is allowed to run around and scream at people anywhere, anytime they want.
Sounds like your kind of place. Complete and total anarchy
The jerk at the center of this debate and all the disruptive jerks before him ( code pink etc…) have all found out the hard way what their rights are and what the law is.
And yet, by virtue of insanity keep going back and do the same thing over and over and keep getting the same results over and over.
And they wonder why they are called the looney left.
April 26th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
“How could you even think that?”
Because the US has a rich history of mass murdering people, financing mass murder and mass murderers, and is notoriously greedy, arrogant, and myopic and ego-centric. This country is like the perfect storm for creating hell on earth for other people.
“The people on that site discuss 9/11. I was discussing the misinformation the media has used leading up to the war and following the war”
They discuss ALOT of things. You’ve identified ONE of them. They also discuss government involvement in 9/11, government complicity in 9/11, goverment coverups regarding 9/11, and goverment deception regarding 9/11 to get us into war.
April 26th, 2008 at 4:15 pm
“It just proved my point that he said he wants to destroy our economy”
According to that letter “they” want to hurt us because WE are hurting THEM. If I were punching you in the face because you were punching me in the face shouldn’t your first course of action be to stop punching me in the face? Instead you would point at me trying to punch you in the face and yell “Look everyone, he wants to hurt me. Let me invade his house, kill his family, break and steal his posessions and declare victory over evil!”
April 26th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
“If you found it so disturbing then you should of just left.”
You obviously find ME disturbing so why don’t YOU just leave?